Magic: Causes leading to the growth in the new age...

[vexen]

Greetings all!

I noticed things seemed a bit dead around here, and I've not seen a much on necromancy, so I thought I'd try to live things up! (Please forgive me for the pun though!!)


I was wondering, it seems that lately it has been easier to talk about the subject of magic without immediately being branded a heretic and burned at the stake. I have a few thoughts on this, and I hope you have some thoughts to share as well, since it marks a cornerstone in both free exploration of magical opportunity and also being able to share ideas without as much fear of censorship. Please, also note the fact that information that was previously considered 'privlaged' is leaking out onto the net going so far as to make it possible to see and learn what previously was considered taboo. I digress though.

Magic has been around awhile, though I haven't personally done research as to the roots of magic (if you have, why not share a thought or two on this?) Is the internet the only reason things have become this way, or are people actually becoming more open minded, either as a result of more wide spread information, or even a different method of upbringing? I've heard some speak of the 'Age of Aquarius', but I will re-iterate, that most of my information is second had.

In my first post I mentioned my belief that most people involved in this group likely has links to magic prior to learning of its' existance, however trivial. Could it be that this is something new, or something that simply has not been allowed for dogmatic traditions and rules, that our inclination to be drawn to magic could be the begining of something big? There again, this is all speculation. I respect the Omnimancer's policy of trying to not be delusional, so take this all with a grain of salt, please. The point that I am trying to make, is that many things happen for a reason (though it is often difficult for an individual to be able to understand or decipher that reason and it seems as chance to many.) Perhaps this is magic's way of calling us together to do something spectacular with our moment of glory on earth. If that is the case, then I call to all of you, stand strong and herald an age where that which was considered magic, is reasoned, not to dispell its' power, but to unvail the curtain that shrowds our understanding of this potentially potent tool.


Disclaimer! My spelling is okay, but I miss a few here and there. Just a warning. Guess it was a little late too, considering if you are reading this you've likely read all of that /\ /\ already.


Please post thoughts that you may have on this matter, or on a similiarly relevant matter!:?:

/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ \/exen \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\

[Ogre]

I think there is a problem with your poll... I think several of those are the strongest reason all at the same time.

The media certainly has helped make magic more common (Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Charmed, even Bewitched from way back when ), but society had to be accepting of it in order for it to happen. We live in a country and time where older, more tradional religion is less important to many, where information is more freely available via the internet, and even at your local library in a lot of places (maybe not in Texas though ). It may also simply be that for whatever reason, it is time for magic to more prevelent in our world again.

In general, our society is becoming more accepting of MANY things, not just magic and alternative religions. Really not too long ago a lesbian kiss on prime time television would NEVER have aired on network television... A couple years ago (I think) Ally McBeal had one. Simply watching the news, you become exposed to a lot more than most ppl would have seen on TV just 10 years ago. The recent war in Iraq demonstrated that quite well.

As far as ppl in this group having had contact with magic previously, it depends on what you mean by links. In the research level students, 4 out of 10 hadn't practiced magic before joining the group. Some of them just needed it proven to them (and it is different for most). Some had played role playing games and had an open mind. One got pulled in because her bf was into it. However, most of our cyber newbies I think had been involved in magic one way or another previously, so it really varies by group, and how someone finds the group (or any group).

What does all that mean? It means I am at work and doing at least 2 things at once, so hopefully this comes through coherently.

BTW, at least 2 of the 3 admins can't spell to save their lives (I am one of the 2 ), and the third either can, or at least spells better than the other 2.

-Ogre

[WolfMan]

I believe that Orgre has a point, the idea of Magic has been around I long, long time. In the the past it was usaully put down by the Church or that the person involved was put away. However, in the last fifty or so years the media i.e. tales of legends, fantasy novels, television shows, movies, the internet, role-playing games, etc. and yes even the ocasional talking head show has brought it more in the opened. Yes, most of it was taken as a fad or worse as being taken as heretics or devil/demon worshippers. However, as the years progressed the media has taken a more open view of things, which is usaully a reflection of the society around it and vica-versa. So it is not surprising that more and more people are getting interested in it or more to the point for those who where interested in there is much more information that is alviable now then ever before.

Just remember for every believer there are literally thousands and thousands out there who don't believe, are indifferent, or debunkers.
That makes our work that much more difficult to do at times.

Da Wolfman

[LordArt]

My spelling is horrible, so don't worry about it.

I was wondering, it seems that lately it has been easier to talk about the subject of magic without immediately being branded a heretic and burned at the stake.

I agree with Ogre, many of the reasons are single entries in your poll. Magic has always been around in one form or another. I mean Edgar Dee(If I remember correctly) in 1800s started up things with Enochian which many other magical systems have based parts of themselves (not that there weren't things before him. He's just an example). Crowley did his work earlier in the 1900s (weird calling it the 1900s). They got enough respect(or notorious) that they weren't burned at the stake.

As far as magic proliferating, I think that started in the 1950s in England with the repeal of the anti-witchcraft laws (which turned them into anti-con/fraud laws). The governments (and the populace) had been replacing the christian god with the god of science since the 1800s. As science accomplished more and more, the general public moved away from christian law as law of the universe and more to something that's nice on sundays and when they are dying (at least in western society which is what we are talking about). Well, in anycase, then the 1960s came with all the hippies. Peace, love and drugs. Well, the hippies are now the senior voters(as in older, not majority), and influencers of society in the last 20 years. The whole idea of the age of aquarious as a popular idea started with them, so they aren't going to hang others for the idea (well most of them anyways). The government had to deal with their type SINCE the 60s, so they have become open to at least the idea. So the minds of people have been stretched to accept new ideas, or at least accept those that do have wierd ideas. The pagan movement trailed on the heels of the New Age movement from the 60's, and gained it's own popularity and strength. And with paganism, came the concept of magic (as far as the main stream being exposed to it). Paganism had a little more meat to it than the New Age concepts did, so once exposed to it, many more people "joined up". (Meaning, certain Pagan religeons could claim historical existance to what they did. For example, in Asatru these days, many of it's followers are scholars of ancient texts and mythologies, just to justify it's legitimacy to those that would try to debunk it saying it was made up.). As hollywood made movies of magic and witchcraft having it be based on the devil, different pagan writting campaigns/protests would be organised to try to show the opposite. Not that I think that did much, but it did a little. The colleges is where the radical ideas always grow in. That's been true at least since the hippie movement. Paganism set up shop in there a long time ago. People would be at least exposed to it even if it only meant hearing of it. By the time the '90s came around, there was enough of a push with all different hidden groups trying to come to the surface, such as homosexuality. It became envogue to come out. The same movement happened with paganism to a point. Many homosexuals moved to paganism since in christianity, it was a hell bent offense and it wasn't in paganism. People heard about it, and looked it up on the net as it was starting to pick up pace. The church had lost it's strangle hold a while ago to science once creationism got kicked out of the students classrooms in the '50s (I think it was then) in favor of evolution. I really think the turning point was the movie "the craft." I know a lot of pagans that bitch about that movie, but honestly, it was the first movie from mainstream hollywood that actually depicted witchs as not satan worshipers, and magic as not a bad thing in a serious mannor (Bewitched and I dream of Genie are good programs but they weren't trying to make a statement or trying to have a message). Based on that movie's success, certainly sent a message to mainstream media and hollywood that such an idea was ok by the general public, and money could be made. So next thing you know, it's everywhere (paganism, or rather the deluted down, really messed up version that hollywood has of it). But it's there, and it is now seen country wide, and anyone who is interested, can find out more from a bookstore (again money to be made), or the internet (please buy my book or teaching style). So now paganism/magic is more seen as a game/con rather than real by the main stream, but it's no more seen as a con as lose 20 lbs in a week diet programs. Mainstream doesn't believe it's real, which is the next true step.



--"It's Good to be Da Mage"

[vexen]

Everyone has brought up some great points!

It is true that many of these are directly related to alot of magics current growth, but try to pin point on what you feel is 'most important'. That is not to say that if the most important was there by itself it would be enough to give magic the success it has seen, simply that it would be the largest contribution to its' growth.

Wolfman makes a good point, it is true that there are many people who would like to dismiss magic, and I will not dispute that point. It is quite possible that many have been here in the past and possbly even made posts, which I do not see, so IF they were here and did post, their post was probably removed, for good reasons. Of course, please do not assume that this has happened (debunker visting, posting, and post getting removed) becuase this is speculation and likely only Lord Art could confirm or debunk my debunker getting debunked by the very debunkiees he aimed at debunking himself! (takes a breath, and appreciates his joke!)

BTW I LOVED all the detail that you went into Lord Art, not to be an ass kisser, but it was quite informative.

Also, I think I have accomplished my goal with this post (bring some lurkers forward/give people something fun to get them involved/ gather information for self and others!) I've noticed that a fair number of people seem to have read it, but that there are yet many more views that can be explored. Expound my friends! Use this wonderful tool that has been provided to you, for otherwise, it may fall into neglect and not be of use to anyone. If nothing else, it's a good excuse to make a bit of noise
I'd better get off my soap box before I get debunked! Happy posting!

\/ 3 )( 3 )\( (Now with 100% more L337 talk!)

[Naryx]

There is no general enlightenment. Most of the world is still ignorant as hell. Nothing you can do or say, no amount of campaigning, no amount of word-spreading, no amount of flyers, forums, emails, or correspondences is going to change that. The population of the earth simply grows to fast for any one person or group to be able to realistically think of a general enlightenment. Anyone who tells you otherwise is ignorant, or knows better and just doesn't want to admit it.

Now thats out of the way, I can get to the part of it that actually has something to do with the topic that is immediately obvious.

Those few who are enlightened enough to actively practice the paths are able to practice because these days theres a little concept called 'human rights' and the anti-centrist feelings that created Democratic and republican processes. Also, the general amount of scientific knowledge has grown to a degree that the intolerant religious powers simply don't have much authority anymore, because their antiquated bullshit no longer has a leg to stand on and they know it as well as I do.

A note to fundamentalist islamics and christians: Wake up. This isn't the dark ages anymore. Ya dumb bastards.

Yes, even I have a sense of humor.